If you only follow one of those links, take a look at the second as it displays these as I'd like them to be viewed; i.e. as a sequence of related images. And in retrospect, that's probably the only shot I should have posted here, with links to the larger versions. You live and learn ;-)
There are probably a few more things I could say about this mini-project but I think I'll conclude by saying that I might develop another area of chromasia for posting this sort of material; i.e. more experimental or project based stuff. One of the main reasons for this, other than the fact that most of you weren't exactly knocked out by these ones, is that I'm moving towards shooting more material that would benefit from a backstory: maybe not as detailed as these needed, but definitely some sort of context/background info, and so on. For those of you who read these descriptions, that's not a problem, but the majority of chromasia's visitors don't. All of which raises a lot of other questions about the nature of our audiences (both in terms of their expectations and ours), but those are questions that I'll leave for another time.
Anyway, I normally ask you to let me know what you think, but I suspect I already know ;-) That said, if there is anything we haven't covered, please let me know.
Update: On a totally unrelated matter: does anyone know of any good German photoblogs? I have a colleague who's working on a news piece, for which he needs some links to good German photoblogs. I would search this out myself, but really don't have much time over the few days so would be grateful of any information.
captured camera lens focal length aperture shutter speed shooting mode exposure bias metering mode ISO flash image quality RAW converter cropped?
12.24pm on 11/6/06
Canon 20D
EF 17-40 f/4L USM
32mm (51mm equiv.)
f/5.0
1/25
aperture priority
-1/3
evaluative
200
no
RAW
C1 Pro
1x1
i really think they work well in a tryptich (sp?). Though compositionally I feel as though the last one works the best. It alone has a little more context.
Well done.
comment byKeith McGowan at 07:31 PM (GMT) on 15 June, 2006
It looks like she is waving good bye which is perhaps no bad thing. Setting a context, or telling us what emotion you were trying to evoke in the viewer to see if it worked is fine, but a number of blogs talk down to the viewer by telling us what to see which is very annoying. Or perhaps worse still a poor image is often supported by text as it is not well enough conceived to get the point across on its own. As you have observed we all see things differently based on our own terms of reference so we will never all 'get it' however well crafted the photograph is. I think the majority of the photoblog audience is mature enough to follow a theme or project especially when you announce that it is to be a theme. Enjoyable debate, it doesnt hurt to think about what we do and why.
comment byMichael Stanton at 07:57 PM (GMT) on 15 June, 2006
Out of the series, I like this one best, not sure why....
comment byAndrew at 08:08 PM (GMT) on 15 June, 2006
Well Dave, I agree this might have worked better as a triptych right off the start with links to the larger images. But hey, live and learn. All in all I don't think this series is as horrible as some people are making it out to be. With a back story to go with, I think these images work well. They're not photographic gems, but I think I've learned a lot about Blackpool through the story and the images. I admit when I saw the first image I was wondering what you were up to, but I figured you had your reasons, and in the end you did. Still thinking about stopping by Blackpool next summer if I actually manage to get to England like I'm planning.
eric: yes, this is my favourite of the three, and I think you're right that that has something to do with the fact that the context is more obvious in this one.
Keith: I've read every one of the 25,911 comments that have been posted on chromasia and have realised that my own view as to the merit of my work doesn't always match with those of you who kindly take the time to comment. Sometimes that bothers me, at others times I end up agreeing, and sometimes I disagree. What's important though is the realisation that I can't determine how my work will received, I can only make suggestions as to how you might view it. So, if you do ever find me telling you what to see, point it out, because that isn't my intention.
Andrew: this will sound a bit like an excuse, but I suspect that if these were "gems" I probably wouldn't feel that they worked so well. Part of their appeal, for me at least, is that they are flawed (in various ways).
comment by Rob at 08:51 PM (GMT) on 15 June, 2006
Bingo - the triple side-by-side works for me tons better than the individual shots. Also the frames work there too.
I have been watching your blog for some time and I will say that since you posted 'the absence of dreams,' I have felt a change in mood. I can't quite put my finger on it. That image and 'urban canvas' seemed almost a departure from your usual stuff. It seems to me that you, the artist, want to have an effect on your subject, make yourself part of the image. I think I say that because I'd never seen you add anything to an image. The blackpool trio of images have a lot of djn in there and not to mention there are a couple self-portraits in there. I may be waaaayyyyy off base, but thats my two cents ;-)
All that being said, the Blackpool trio is great, it makes me wonder where those girls are now. Every dancer has a story and its usually a doosy. Great job!
comment byJamey at 09:41 PM (GMT) on 15 June, 2006
As a lone image - I prefer this to the other two and apart from the border (which I maintain is cyber-cheesy), I quite like it.
As a series - they look nicer side-by-side than I thought they were going to, I have to admit. But I still think the approach to them wasn't really befitting true series work, however that's entirely my opinion and I'm aware that it was a bit impromptu as well.
Overall - while this particular set of three hasn't made much impression on me, I definitely want to see more series-based stuff from you. But I'd ask you to think carefully about how to approach it. Don't use the fact that an image will be viewed alongside other images as an excuse to produce them to a lower standard than normal (I'm not necessarily saying that's what you did with these three, just mentioning it as a point to bear in mind). For example - if you'd normally use a tripod, then do so. Don't assume that hand-held will be good enough just because it's part of a series and you don't want to go home for the Manfrotto.
And just to reiterate - I'm not getting at you, just trying to be constructive. Hope that comes across. I can sometimes be quite aggressive in my phraseology.
I'm really surprised, this is not only by far the best of the three but is actually a great image (I agree with Jamey - drop the border, but it's there for personal reasons so fair enough). The fact that the girl does not dominate the picture as much actually puts the message across far more eloquently. I'm a little unclear as to why this warrants a series though as for me this picture tells the story on its own without the need for the previous two. Why show another girl with another Blackpool landmark with the same border; what does that add?
I think it's a good idea to do some more serial / project stuff. It is true that some motives and places only make sense when shown in more than one shot. Oh, and I like the way you question "traditional" photoblogging (if that exists) and dare to get on your visitors' nerves.
German photoblogs I like: < href="http://web631.webbox240.server-home.org/blog/photoblog/">Kwerfeldein and mine. :)
comment byhuimin at 04:48 AM (GMT) on 16 June, 2006
good shot!!
comment bynavin harish at 06:14 AM (GMT) on 16 June, 2006
Indeed John, a lot of people will be relieved, specially after thinking about complaining comments you got on the image you posted a few months ago of a mennequin wearing a cap saying something about swallowing :)
comment by Michael at 06:22 AM (GMT) on 16 June, 2006
David
I have been following your site for sometime. This is my first comment. I like it. Photography is an art and you do it well. No image should be
left out or commented out.
I look to see more of your creativity in the future. I have also am a photographer since 40 years ago. I do not have a blog yet but will let you know when I do.
Regardless of the subjective merits of these images, why on earth would you want to allow visitors comments to dictate the content of Chromasia? OK, they may not be popular (look at the some of the crud that IS popular!), we can all have an opinion and comments are always welcome, but in the end it's your blog, your artistic exploration and if you're the only person that "gets it" and are convinced that what you're doing is the right thing, then keep right on doing it. Why shunt it off to some "niche" area? People deserve to be challenged rather than pandered to. There is a lot of photography and music that doesn't personally appeal to me but I can respect the intent and admire the execution; I'm glad it came to my attention rather than being filtered out.
These images may be better presented as a series, but I don't feel that they don't also have a place here.
I like the series, Dave, and I think this last shot is the best of three.
Looking a this I can feel the atmosphere of something that was, and that's anymore. Great the idea of developing a section dedicated to this kind of work.
comment bymartin at 11:33 AM (GMT) on 16 June, 2006
Hey Dave. I would suggest mine . Maybe your friend can use it :-)
comment bymooch at 11:36 AM (GMT) on 16 June, 2006
I suppose comment wise I find photography and the perception of work intriguing. You post an image you consider strong and very few comments come your way. Then you post an image you are uncertain about and lo and behold, the compliments fly in. Not sure quite what importance I place on comments anymore. I find that the majority tend to be reciprocal. "Your image is lovely". "No no, your image is lovely". I would rather those outside the blog world appreciated my work, providing a whole different form of compliment, if you follow.
comment by Paul Courtney at 02:08 PM (GMT) on 16 June, 2006
Hi Dave,
Having been in hospital with my little boy for the last 3 days I've had the benefit of being able to view this series at one sitting, now he's out. It's taken me the last hour to read all the comments, and thought I'd comment. As individual photos I didn't find them particularly inspiring, in fact I'd go as far as to say that they portayed exactly my view of Blackpool as being the sleeze capital of England, but as a series which tells a story I feel that they need an ending. I need to see the regeneration to understand why you've posted these as 'times gone by'. Clearly from all your other shots from in and around Blackpool there are some beautiful areas, however, as someone else commented, the Pleasure Beach is the main money-earner for the area, so I assume that the bars and clubs will still exist and you'll still get them advertising themselves in similar fashion, so I can't see the light at the end of the tunnel.
More shots like 'The Long Road' and 'The West Wind' please, a little less challenging for a lunchtinme!!!
Great discussions though.
comment byKarl Baumann at 04:34 PM (GMT) on 16 June, 2006
That´s the best one of thre trilogy but I don´t really like it at all.
comment bychristoph at 05:38 PM (GMT) on 16 June, 2006
for a good german photoblog, you might want to look at www.blimage.de
they only list german/swiss/austrian photoblogs and i think the top 10 (probably more than that) can be considered "good"
ok, the three as a set was a much better idea than the one at a time approach, saying that I do not like the set. As others have said the border gives an impression of cheap ametuerism, like you stuck a template over the top of your pictures and kind of lowers the impression of the rest of your work/ site.
The photos themselves I just dont understand, to me all I see is a photo of a photo. Although I enjoyed your background story you could of implemented much better photos to illustrate it. You thought of your story after shooting the pictures, and I see the story as a way of justifying the pictures.
Definitely shoot more series like this, but think of your concept/story then take your photos with it in mind. It will work out much better and your viewer will see the story without having to be told it.
Thanks everyone. And I know there are a couple of issues I've not picked up on from your comments, but I'm totally wiped out this evening. I'll try and catch up over the next day or so.
comment bynogger at 10:24 PM (GMT) on 16 June, 2006
I've got to say that one of the things I like about Blackpool, and always have I think, is its "tackyness".
It's working class and always has been as long as I've been going there - since I was a kid. That's its appeal. To me, at least. It's what it was built on, all those factory workers enjoying their "wakes".
In some ways it's unique and I just love it. And so I like these three images because they just say Blackpool to me. Backgrounds and all.
Well, the majority of you can breathe a sigh of relief as this is the last in this series ;-)
If you'd like to see them all on one page you can view them here:
.../archives/viva_blackpool.php
And there's another set of them here (this time, side by side):
.../archives/viva_blackpool_2.php
If you only follow one of those links, take a look at the second as it displays these as I'd like them to be viewed; i.e. as a sequence of related images. And in retrospect, that's probably the only shot I should have posted here, with links to the larger versions. You live and learn ;-)
There are probably a few more things I could say about this mini-project but I think I'll conclude by saying that I might develop another area of chromasia for posting this sort of material; i.e. more experimental or project based stuff. One of the main reasons for this, other than the fact that most of you weren't exactly knocked out by these ones, is that I'm moving towards shooting more material that would benefit from a backstory: maybe not as detailed as these needed, but definitely some sort of context/background info, and so on. For those of you who read these descriptions, that's not a problem, but the majority of chromasia's visitors don't. All of which raises a lot of other questions about the nature of our audiences (both in terms of their expectations and ours), but those are questions that I'll leave for another time.
Anyway, I normally ask you to let me know what you think, but I suspect I already know ;-) That said, if there is anything we haven't covered, please let me know.
Update: On a totally unrelated matter: does anyone know of any good German photoblogs? I have a colleague who's working on a news piece, for which he needs some links to good German photoblogs. I would search this out myself, but really don't have much time over the few days so would be grateful of any information.
camera
lens
focal length
aperture
shutter speed
shooting mode
exposure bias
metering mode
ISO
flash
image quality
RAW converter
cropped?
Canon 20D
EF 17-40 f/4L USM
32mm (51mm equiv.)
f/5.0
1/25
aperture priority
-1/3
evaluative
200
no
RAW
C1 Pro
1x1
eroticaly artistic. two things that usualy go well together
Stains, eh.
cool shot. well spotted
i really think they work well in a tryptich (sp?). Though compositionally I feel as though the last one works the best. It alone has a little more context.
Well done.
It looks like she is waving good bye which is perhaps no bad thing. Setting a context, or telling us what emotion you were trying to evoke in the viewer to see if it worked is fine, but a number of blogs talk down to the viewer by telling us what to see which is very annoying. Or perhaps worse still a poor image is often supported by text as it is not well enough conceived to get the point across on its own. As you have observed we all see things differently based on our own terms of reference so we will never all 'get it' however well crafted the photograph is. I think the majority of the photoblog audience is mature enough to follow a theme or project especially when you announce that it is to be a theme. Enjoyable debate, it doesnt hurt to think about what we do and why.
Out of the series, I like this one best, not sure why....
Well Dave, I agree this might have worked better as a triptych right off the start with links to the larger images. But hey, live and learn. All in all I don't think this series is as horrible as some people are making it out to be. With a back story to go with, I think these images work well. They're not photographic gems, but I think I've learned a lot about Blackpool through the story and the images. I admit when I saw the first image I was wondering what you were up to, but I figured you had your reasons, and in the end you did. Still thinking about stopping by Blackpool next summer if I actually manage to get to England like I'm planning.
eric: yes, this is my favourite of the three, and I think you're right that that has something to do with the fact that the context is more obvious in this one.
Keith: I've read every one of the 25,911 comments that have been posted on chromasia and have realised that my own view as to the merit of my work doesn't always match with those of you who kindly take the time to comment. Sometimes that bothers me, at others times I end up agreeing, and sometimes I disagree. What's important though is the realisation that I can't determine how my work will received, I can only make suggestions as to how you might view it. So, if you do ever find me telling you what to see, point it out, because that isn't my intention.
Andrew: this will sound a bit like an excuse, but I suspect that if these were "gems" I probably wouldn't feel that they worked so well. Part of their appeal, for me at least, is that they are flawed (in various ways).
Bingo - the triple side-by-side works for me tons better than the individual shots. Also the frames work there too.
It was worth the experiment.
David:
I have been watching your blog for some time and I will say that since you posted 'the absence of dreams,' I have felt a change in mood. I can't quite put my finger on it. That image and 'urban canvas' seemed almost a departure from your usual stuff. It seems to me that you, the artist, want to have an effect on your subject, make yourself part of the image. I think I say that because I'd never seen you add anything to an image. The blackpool trio of images have a lot of djn in there and not to mention there are a couple self-portraits in there. I may be waaaayyyyy off base, but thats my two cents ;-)
All that being said, the Blackpool trio is great, it makes me wonder where those girls are now. Every dancer has a story and its usually a doosy. Great job!
As a lone image - I prefer this to the other two and apart from the border (which I maintain is cyber-cheesy), I quite like it.
As a series - they look nicer side-by-side than I thought they were going to, I have to admit. But I still think the approach to them wasn't really befitting true series work, however that's entirely my opinion and I'm aware that it was a bit impromptu as well.
Overall - while this particular set of three hasn't made much impression on me, I definitely want to see more series-based stuff from you. But I'd ask you to think carefully about how to approach it. Don't use the fact that an image will be viewed alongside other images as an excuse to produce them to a lower standard than normal (I'm not necessarily saying that's what you did with these three, just mentioning it as a point to bear in mind). For example - if you'd normally use a tripod, then do so. Don't assume that hand-held will be good enough just because it's part of a series and you don't want to go home for the Manfrotto.
And just to reiterate - I'm not getting at you, just trying to be constructive. Hope that comes across. I can sometimes be quite aggressive in my phraseology.
Much better side by side.
I'm really surprised, this is not only by far the best of the three but is actually a great image (I agree with Jamey - drop the border, but it's there for personal reasons so fair enough). The fact that the girl does not dominate the picture as much actually puts the message across far more eloquently. I'm a little unclear as to why this warrants a series though as for me this picture tells the story on its own without the need for the previous two. Why show another girl with another Blackpool landmark with the same border; what does that add?
I think it's a good idea to do some more serial / project stuff. It is true that some motives and places only make sense when shown in more than one shot. Oh, and I like the way you question "traditional" photoblogging (if that exists) and dare to get on your visitors' nerves.
German photoblogs I like: < href="http://web631.webbox240.server-home.org/blog/photoblog/">Kwerfeldein and mine. :)
The Kwerfeldein link: Kwefeldein
good shot!!
Indeed John, a lot of people will be relieved, specially after thinking about complaining comments you got on the image you posted a few months ago of a mennequin wearing a cap saying something about swallowing :)
David
I have been following your site for sometime. This is my first comment. I like it. Photography is an art and you do it well. No image should be
left out or commented out.
I look to see more of your creativity in the future. I have also am a photographer since 40 years ago. I do not have a blog yet but will let you know when I do.
Keep up the really great work.
Michael
dave, http://www.wait-a-second.de/
The best one blackpool.
Regardless of the subjective merits of these images, why on earth would you want to allow visitors comments to dictate the content of Chromasia? OK, they may not be popular (look at the some of the crud that IS popular!), we can all have an opinion and comments are always welcome, but in the end it's your blog, your artistic exploration and if you're the only person that "gets it" and are convinced that what you're doing is the right thing, then keep right on doing it. Why shunt it off to some "niche" area? People deserve to be challenged rather than pandered to. There is a lot of photography and music that doesn't personally appeal to me but I can respect the intent and admire the execution; I'm glad it came to my attention rather than being filtered out.
These images may be better presented as a series, but I don't feel that they don't also have a place here.
Nice series!
Concerning good german photoblogs - try --> www.cryoscenic.net
;-)
Greetz!
I like the series, Dave, and I think this last shot is the best of three.
Looking a this I can feel the atmosphere of something that was, and that's anymore. Great the idea of developing a section dedicated to this kind of work.
Hey Dave. I would suggest mine
. Maybe your friend can use it :-)
I suppose comment wise I find photography and the perception of work intriguing. You post an image you consider strong and very few comments come your way. Then you post an image you are uncertain about and lo and behold, the compliments fly in. Not sure quite what importance I place on comments anymore. I find that the majority tend to be reciprocal. "Your image is lovely". "No no, your image is lovely". I would rather those outside the blog world appreciated my work, providing a whole different form of compliment, if you follow.
Hi Dave,
Having been in hospital with my little boy for the last 3 days I've had the benefit of being able to view this series at one sitting, now he's out. It's taken me the last hour to read all the comments, and thought I'd comment. As individual photos I didn't find them particularly inspiring, in fact I'd go as far as to say that they portayed exactly my view of Blackpool as being the sleeze capital of England, but as a series which tells a story I feel that they need an ending. I need to see the regeneration to understand why you've posted these as 'times gone by'. Clearly from all your other shots from in and around Blackpool there are some beautiful areas, however, as someone else commented, the Pleasure Beach is the main money-earner for the area, so I assume that the bars and clubs will still exist and you'll still get them advertising themselves in similar fashion, so I can't see the light at the end of the tunnel.
More shots like 'The Long Road' and 'The West Wind' please, a little less challenging for a lunchtinme!!!
Great discussions though.
That´s the best one of thre trilogy but I don´t really like it at all.
for a good german photoblog, you might want to look at www.blimage.de
they only list german/swiss/austrian photoblogs and i think the top 10 (probably more than that) can be considered "good"
ok, the three as a set was a much better idea than the one at a time approach, saying that I do not like the set. As others have said the border gives an impression of cheap ametuerism, like you stuck a template over the top of your pictures and kind of lowers the impression of the rest of your work/ site.
The photos themselves I just dont understand, to me all I see is a photo of a photo. Although I enjoyed your background story you could of implemented much better photos to illustrate it. You thought of your story after shooting the pictures, and I see the story as a way of justifying the pictures.
Definitely shoot more series like this, but think of your concept/story then take your photos with it in mind. It will work out much better and your viewer will see the story without having to be told it.
Lee.
Thanks everyone. And I know there are a couple of issues I've not picked up on from your comments, but I'm totally wiped out this evening. I'll try and catch up over the next day or so.
I've got to say that one of the things I like about Blackpool, and always have I think, is its "tackyness".
It's working class and always has been as long as I've been going there - since I was a kid. That's its appeal. To me, at least. It's what it was built on, all those factory workers enjoying their "wakes".
In some ways it's unique and I just love it. And so I like these three images because they just say Blackpool to me. Backgrounds and all.